Boards to discuss Hârn, HârnWorld, HârnMaster, and RPGs in general.
Links - Home - Kelestia Productions - Columbia Games Inc
It is currently Mon May 20, 2013 10:02 am

All times are UTC + 10 hours [ DST ]




Post new topic Reply to topic  [ 30 posts ]  Go to page Previous  1, 2
Author Message
PostPosted: Tue Feb 09, 2010 12:21 am 
Offline
Bailiff
Bailiff
User avatar

Joined: Thu Oct 30, 2008 9:46 pm
Posts: 876
Yes and no.

Based on the gambeson you wear and the mail quality, it can be very different.

Getting some high quality chainmail, like a standard medieval suit, isn't easy and is a lot expensive.

My experience is this:

1) A good (I mean a lot padded) gambeson is a way more cumbesome and hotter than chain mail.
2) A slash from a sword, based on the strike location, may be nothing more than a soft blunt to a painful bruise.
3) Thrust are felt, expecially on thorax.
4) Generally we avoid hitting in the head when there is only chainmail :D
5) Mail is a lot easyer to fight in, so you are more capable of dodging blows (footing).

I'm not a Master. My experience is all based on selfteching, practising and reading of historical texts.

_________________
Si vis pacem, para bellum
I Signori della Guerra: http://www.isignoridellaguerra.com


Top
 Profile  
 
PostPosted: Thu Feb 11, 2010 12:35 am 
Offline
Woodward
Woodward
User avatar

Joined: Thu May 21, 2009 12:12 pm
Posts: 158
thanks for the info, very interesting.

_________________
Where I Store Harnmaster Stuff


Top
 Profile  
 
PostPosted: Wed Mar 03, 2010 9:31 am 
Offline
Knight
Knight
User avatar

Joined: Wed Feb 27, 2002 10:16 am
Posts: 1554
Location: Calgary, Alberta, Canada
Munin wrote:
Anyone who trains in a Japanese martial art dating from before or during Sengoku Jidai (Japan's "Warring States" period) will tell you exactly how utterly pragmatic it is.


I study both German and Japanese swordsmanship (Hyoho Niten Ichi Ryu). The techniques are really quite similar, and any reading of Go Rin No Sho certainly strikes a chord with those who have read the German masters. The main difference is the focus on the bind in the German school, which is not often present in many Japanese ryuha.

One is reminded of the manuscript HS 3227a, written in 1389 and formerly attributed to Hanko Dobringer. It states "there is only one art of the sword", and he's right. The principles are universal, but some of the particulars change due to the tools involved, even within a given art.

I once had the honour of doing a demo of German longsword for an HNIR seminar, and the instructor said "that looks a lot like our advanced stuff". There is much more the same between east and west than is different with regards to practical combat techniques. But depending on one's mindset, one will find either the similarities or the differences more interesting. When learning HNIR, I was able off the start to graft it onto the structure that German longsword had given me to understand the basic idea of a given technique, and learn the finer points later. A kenjutsu practicioner could do the same thing in reverse in learning European longsword, of course.

In my view, a late medieval European knight would not have felt much out of place training in a feudal Japanese dojo (cultural issues notwithstanding), and a hypothetical Samurai who found himself training in a German fechtschule would be familiar with much of the syllabus already from his own training. The bigger problem for both of them would be the alien culture, not the combat techniques. :)

Best regards,

-Mark

_________________
Putting the "Ho" in Hodiri since 1998.
The Forge: Western Martial Arts


Top
 Profile  
 
PostPosted: Mon Mar 08, 2010 5:01 pm 
Offline
Sheriff
Sheriff
User avatar

Joined: Mon Aug 18, 2003 11:20 am
Posts: 5072
Location: St Louis, Missourishire
Quote:
The bigger problem for both of them would be the alien culture, not the combat techniques.


Unfortunately there is not the depth of manual information for things like sword and shield or spear and shield combat, would be nice if this was more formalized and written down.

I'm sure there was a formalized to an extent type of training for this - the manuals of the later renaissance did not just spring into existence - it was likley based on a possibly verbal tradition.

_________________
Hmm Gurthang. What a nice name for a sword....


Top
 Profile  
 
PostPosted: Tue Mar 09, 2010 2:02 am 
Offline
Knight
Knight
User avatar

Joined: Wed Feb 27, 2002 10:16 am
Posts: 1554
Location: Calgary, Alberta, Canada
Turin wrote:
Unfortunately there is not the depth of manual information for things like sword and shield or spear and shield combat, would be nice if this was more formalized and written down.

I'm sure there was a formalized to an extent type of training for this - the manuals of the later renaissance did not just spring into existence - it was likley based on a possibly verbal tradition.


Yeah, that would have been cool. Our only decent sources remain I.33 (sword and buckler), Italian renaissance rotella, and Scottish sword and targe.

Interestingly enough, the German group Hammaborg has done some wonderful stuff on adapting both I.33 and Talhoffer's duelling shields for viking sword and shield. Search for them on youtube. It would at least give you an idea on how one-on-one combat with those weapons might have worked.

Best regards,

-Mark

_________________
Putting the "Ho" in Hodiri since 1998.
The Forge: Western Martial Arts


Top
 Profile  
 
Display posts from previous:  Sort by  
Post new topic Reply to topic  [ 30 posts ]  Go to page Previous  1, 2

All times are UTC + 10 hours [ DST ]


Who is online

Users browsing this forum: No registered users and 2 guests


You cannot post new topics in this forum
You cannot reply to topics in this forum
You cannot edit your posts in this forum
You cannot delete your posts in this forum
You cannot post attachments in this forum

Jump to:  
cron
Powered by phpBB® Forum Software © phpBB Group